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Posted by 4zb4, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:49 am
Along with what red kangaroo said, the best thing you can possibly do right at the start is pick up a weapon and stick with it for the entire first section (or at least stick within the same weapon type).
That will go a long way to not getting mauled by hedgehogs and the boss. Armor is a crapshoot as to whether you get anything but even the worst armor is better than no armor because a lack of armor results in an increased chance of taking a critical hit.
If you're unable to find a weapon before your first hedgehog, Kenny the puppy can likely take it out for you, otherwise you can probably survive punching one to death. Or you can wield your lantern and probably beat the hedgehog to death with it without risking your arms.

Also, try not to be burdened and rest ("h") to regain health between encounters - pick an empty room to nap in.
If you MUST carry all the stuff and be burdened, at least drop enough to remove the burdened status before getting into a serious fight.

Finally, don't underestimate wands. Basically any of the offensive wands will guarantee you a win against the boss.
Posted by 4zb4, Dec 18, 2016 at 6:42 pm
Serin-Delaunay wrote
You can get non-weapon damage values by wielding the item you want to test and using the wizmode command "character attack info" (b). That lists the attack values for both wielded items. A valpurium banana peel has damage 1-3, the same as a teak mace.

I learned something today!
That's actually pretty good going for a banana peel.

Too bad you can't enchant peels or they might actually be a silly feasible weapon.
The only other decent misc weapon I remember trying was a Large Chest, which, iirc had a pretty good block chance. Good luck wielding one though.
Posted by 4zb4, Dec 15, 2016 at 10:11 pm
Batman? wrote
Would valpurium bananna peels still rot? Do people still slip on them?

Only items made of organic materials rot. And yes, you can still slip over changed material banana peels.


chaostrom wrote
Can someone do a comparison for different material banana peels?

I wouldn't mind doing this if the game actually showed damage numbers for wielded items that aren't weapons, but it doesn't.
The damage calculations are VERY long winded so I don't feel particularly moved to check it myself.
Posted by 4zb4, Dec 15, 2016 at 7:36 pm
fejoa wrote
How about banana peels?

Banana peels:
  • Weapon strength: 447
  • Base damage: 0.149
  • Block modifier: 400
  • DexExp per swing: 300 (exceeds the limit and defaults to maximum EXP)

Side note: changing the banana peel's material will make it a much better weapon. Just for fun I changed a banana peel to valpurium and one-shot a hedgehog with starting stats.
Posted by 4zb4, Dec 15, 2016 at 5:18 pm
Belts are classed as Whip category weapons so yes they do make good weapons. Much better than any other piece of armor which use the Misc weapon category and suffer as a result.

As for dex training and the belt of carrying being better, I'll go take a quick look at the code now.

EDIT:
Done my research!

The belt of carrying isn't a better weapon than a regular belt by default. All of its physical properties are identical to a regular belt, which means that it will have the same combat abilities.
It was probably only a better weapon because all belts of carrying spawn enchanted to +1.

As for whether they train dexterity better than whips... well there's no hard-coded bonus or anything but my research so far is leaning towards yes!

Blocking trains DEX. Blocking is heavily influenced by the Roundness and Size properties of an item - higher is better. Belts have a block modifier of 3000 whereas whips have a block modifier of 840 - belts are much more likely to block (parry) which means more chances to gain dex experience.

Combat also trains DEX.
According to the code, you get the same amount of experience regardless of whether the attack misses, is dodged or blocked/parried so tohitvalue isn't really important for what we're investigating here (belts have higher to-hit btw).
However the amount of experience you get is influenced by a weapon's weight value using the following formula:
DexExp = Weight ? Limit(75000 / Weight, 75, 300) : 300;

The Limit function places a limit (duh) on how much DEX experience you gain from a swing. The EXP gained must fit between 75 or 300, otherwise it defaults to 300.
For belts that's:

DexExp = 200 ? Limit(375, 75, 300) : 300; //(leather belts always get 300 exp because they exceed the limits)

And whips:

DexExp = 420 ? Limit(178, 75, 300) : 300; //(leather whips will only get 178 exp per swing because they do not exceed the 75 minimum and 300 maximum limits)

Which strongly suggests that yes! Belts do train DEX faster than whips in every way!
Things might get a little more dicey with the higher tier materials however - might drive the limits over for whips, or under for belts. But I am not going to go do any more digging there.


I figured I'd also look into damage for belts and whips while I was here.
This largely depends on GetWeaponStrength, with (most) other factors depending on player stats etc.
I'll just post the equations:

Leather belt:
return GetFormModifier() * GetMainMaterial()->GetStrengthValue() * sqrt(GetMainMaterial()->GetWeight());
5 * 20 * sqrt(weight)
5 * 20 * sqrt(200)
5 * 20 * 14 = 1400 weapon strength

This translates to 0.265 base damage.

Leather whip:
return GetFormModifier() * GetMainMaterial()->GetStrengthValue() * sqrt(GetMainMaterial()->GetWeight());
10 * 20 * sqrt(weight)
10 * 20 * sqrt(420)
10 * 20 * 20 = 4000 weapon strength

Which is 0.447 base damage.
Whips are obviously the stronger of the two.
Posted by 4zb4, Dec 12, 2016 at 2:37 pm
Or even just a normal giant porcupine?
Posted by 4zb4, Dec 11, 2016 at 2:13 am
fejoa wrote
I like the second version. It looks like the communist star... Perfect! Can you merge it in on Github? If not, then just send me the file

Done, hopefully correctly.
Posted by 4zb4, Dec 11, 2016 at 12:04 am
Here's my first draft - not happy with it yet because it looks kinda out of place in-game.

100% size:


200% size for easier viewing:




EDIT: Second version trying to make the pentagon-building more distinct

On a forest:


On tundra:

Posted by 4zb4, Dec 10, 2016 at 2:36 am
fejoa wrote
Ok I'm looking for a new 16x16 graphic to use as the new Tomb of Xinroch icon on the worldmap. It should go into wterra.pcx. Anyone got any good designs?

I can whip one up for consideration if you give me a little time.
Posted by 4zb4, Dec 9, 2016 at 11:18 pm
red_kangaroo wrote
How did this project end? It would be cool to have stone armor in the game!

I forgot about it among other stuff that I had to do out in the real world.
I still have the work I did on it sitting around somewhere, I'll need to dig it up - haven't given up on it and I'd still like to follow through.

Batman? wrote
its always cool to have new and different items in the game, but what would the value of them be? at that weight they are borderline useless,and it only provides a base armor of 9. Am I missing something?

It's mostly a novelty, but the idea was to have an obscenely strong piece of armor that was organically locked out of usage by most people because of the requirements. That is to say, if you found a way to consistently be able to use it, it'd be godlike.
More importantly though, I was going to have a new kind of monster wear the full set - so you'd have access to this super-good armor pretty easily if you could take them down, but being able to use it yourself is an entirely different story.

And yes, you're also missing something because I was going to artificially inflate the armor value (AV) to make it worth it - 9 isn't worth it at all, I had my sights set on something like 30-50 depending on the material. I actually think some of them had AVs in that range but I don't quite remember, once I've found where I put the files I'll fire up a game and see.

Also I'd like to take this opportunity to say that refusing to add items to the game because "they're not practical" is dangerous thinking and gets on my nerves, especially for roguelikes. Just because the thing "isn't good" is not a good reason to not have it in the game. Take a look at balsa spears for instance.
It's not about adding things to make it easier/more interesting for the player, it's about what makes the game more interesting, colourful, challenging and fun. None of this munchkin stuff.

Red Kangaroo has basically summed up what I was going for too.

EDIT: Found the files!
Here are the currently existing stone armors - still a bit low for what I was planning for: